Saturday, October 17, 2015

A word about "Torah terrorists" and "Pagan police"

I would love to know what it is that causes people who find their way to Torah to become radical Torah terrorists.  My goodness, I understand how exuberant one can be when their eyes are finally opened to the whole Truth, but instead of embracing this newly-discovered Truth and continuously learning, some get stuck on the disappointment they felt about having “been deceived” in their grace-only churches; and instead of acting all “grown-up” about it, they decide to retaliate by going on an angry rampages to give all their Christian friends a Torah concussion, sending to hell anyone who dares use the English titles of “Lord” or “God” and freaking out over the use of  “Jesus” – literally going into crazed verbal tirades about how these things are supposedly “pagan.”

I’m sorry, but I have come to the conclusion that people who do these things have a screw loose.  I encountered one of “them” recently when she sent me a friend request on Facebook – and she lasted all of maybe five minutes before I blocked her!

I absolutely couldn’t handle the flogging she gave me for using the term “God”. (I only did it because she admitted to having been Torah observant for only two years.  Whenever I talk to anyone, I always assess “where they are” when it comes to “God and the Bible” and try to use terms they are familiar with.)  Anyway, she illuminated me to the idea that “God” refers to a Norse god whose name was God, and that Grace, Hope and Charity are Roman goddesses - and so if I used any of these terms I was calling on pagan deities...

Well, this very short and tense conversation quickly disgusted me and I told her I was sorry that the “Pagan Police” had obviously gotten a hold of her...and of course, she felt compelled to share that it wasn’t the “Pagan Police” but that the BIBLE says we cannot use the term “God.”

The Bible says that?  Really?  The Bible tells us we cannot use the English term for ELOHIM (God) or ADONAI (Lord)?  POPPYCOCK!

Okay, so I wished her well and immediately blocked her, because I know from experience that you cannot carry on a rational conversation with a “pagan police” lunatic.  This woman – like many who find their way to Torah – was so arrogant and so full of herself, NO amount of explanation would have sufficed. I'm sure she will argue with Y'shua some day when she sees him! There’s a wonderful old adage that fits her well:  “Those convinced against their will are of the same opinion still.”

Anyway, it truly bugs me that some people feel compelled to put others down, and basically lord themselves (oops, am I going to hell now???) over others!  Scripture commands us to be firm yet gentle with those who are learning (i.e, Titus 3:2, 1 Peter 3:15, 2 Timothy 2:24-26, etc). 

How can you witness to someone if you’re berating or “yelling” at them or – as in the case of some Hebrew Roots types who like to throw around Hebrew terms to make themselves sound like they are brilliant - speaking a foreign language?  That kind of stuff is fine when you’re around others who understand what you’re saying, but what good does it do a newcomer to Torah who has just begun to learn that Jesus’ real Name is Yeshua and that YHWH’s people are supposed to keep the Seventh Day holy?  You might as well start talking about the Pythagorean Theorem or quantum physics!

Anyway, I said all this because I am truly sick to death of the “Torah terrorists” and the “pagan police” and all those who like to lord themselves (oops, I used that word “lord” again – shame on me!) over others.  I especially cannot stand it when those who are new to Torah suddenly think they have the market cornered on YHWH’s Truth and they feel automatically qualified to teach others by shoving their "exalted" OPINIONS down the world's collective throat!

1 Corinthians 13:1 If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal.
(ESV)

2 Timothy 2:14 Keep reminding people of this, and charge them solemnly before our Master (Y'shua) not to engage in word-battles. They accomplish nothing useful and are a catastrophe for the hearers! 15 Do all you can to present yourself to Elohim as someone worthy of his approval, as a worker with no need to be ashamed, because he deals straightforwardly with the Word of the Truth.  16 But keep away from godless babbling, for those who engage in it will only become more ungodly, 17 and their teaching will eat away at people like gangrene. (CJB)

2 Timothy 2:23. Avoid those foolish discussions which afford no instruction; for you know that they generate arguments.  24. And a servant of our Master (Y’shua) you should not contend with, but to be mild towards everyone and instructive and patient; 25. that with mildness he may enlighten those who dispute against him if perhaps Elohim may give them repentance and they may acknowledge the truth,  26 and may recollect themselves and may escape out of the snare of Satan, at whose pleasure they have been held ensnared. (AENT)

2 Timothy 3:1. But know this: That in the latter days hard times will come:  2. and men will be lovers of themselves and lovers of money, boasters, proud, revilers, unyielding towards their own people, deniers of grace, wicked,  3. unloving, addicted to irreconcilable malicious gossips, ferocious, haters of the good,  4. treacherous, rash, inflated, attached to pleasure more than to the love of Elohim,  5. having a form of respect for Elohim but wide from the power of Elohim. Them who are such, repel from you.  6. For of them are they who creep into this and that house and captivate the women who are plunged in sins and led away by divers lusts,  7. who are always learning, and can never come to the knowledge of the truth. (AENT)

Romans 13:12. The night now passes away, and the day draws near. Let us therefore cast from us the works of darkness; and let us put on the armor of light.  13. And let us walk decorously, as in daylight; not in merriment, nor in drunkenness, nor in impurity of the bed, nor in envy and strife.  14. But clothe yourselves with our Master Y’shua the Mashiyach: and pay no concern about your flesh for the indulgence of appetites.  (AENT)

Romans 14:  19  So then let us pursue what makes for peace and for mutual upbuilding. (CJB)


So here is the scoop, just in case someone still doesn't get it:

"God" is simply the English translation for ELOHIM.  There is nothing "pagan" about that.  In German the word is "Gott."  It STILL refers to YHWH as the TITLE of YHWH.  I don't understand what is so hard about understanding that there are different languages on earth, and the word for His TITLE is absolutely NOT pagan.

He has ONE NAME and that is YHWH.  Anything else is a TITLE!   When I say I love God, He knows who I am referring to.  When I say "God" (His TITLE) I am certainly NOT calling on Zeus, Baal, Allah, Visnu or George or John or Harriet)....Please see our article that explains that "Jesus" NEVER came from anything pagan - that idea was made up by thick-headed people who have a comprehension problem and like to push conspiracy theories! 

I was "saved" "in the Name of Jesus"...He drew me to Himself when I only knew Him as "Jesus."  If it had been "pagan" then He would NEVER have done that!  I use the proper Names, but sometimes - when speaking to Christians - I use the TITLE of God, because that is what they are familiar with.  I will NOT be verbally beaten to a pulp for that.  If someone doesn't like it, they can simply "unfriend" me!

30 comments:

  1. I know there are Scriptures where YHWH (Yermeyah 23, Yeshayahu 46) tells us that he doesn't answer to other names (Baal, Zeus, Allah, Vishnu, Krishna, Saturn, etc.), that these are the names of pagan deities. I also know there is a verse in the Torah that tells believers not to mix the Word of YHWH with pagan doctrines (Paul has similar messages in his letters {2 Corinthians 11:14}).

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    1. Yes, but the thing is, "God" is the English translation for ELOHIM. There is nothing wrong with that. In German the word is "Gott" It STILL refers to YHWH as the TITLE of YHWH. I don't understand what is so hard about understanding that there are different languages on earth, and the word for His TITLE is absolutely NOT pagan. My goodness, He has ONE NAME and that is YHWH. That is what He answers to. When I say I love God, He knows who I am referring to. When I say "God" (His TITLE) I am certainly NOT calling on Zeus, Baal, Allah, Visnu or George or John)....Please see our article that explains that "Jesus" NEVER came from anything pagan - that idea was made up by thick-headed people who have a comprehension problem and like to push conspiracy theories! http://blog.therefinersfire.org/2015/09/should-we-use-name-jesus-instead-of.html

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    2. Isaiah 65:11 is a good verse and certainly speaks to the point Kevin made but is not Torah, it is from the Nevi'im (Prophets).

      Deuteronomy 12:2-4; 12:29-31 is an example from Torah. And Genesis 35:2, Exodus 20:3, Deuteronomy 7:4-5

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  2. Paul said I become all thing that I might win some. So that is what you are doing. This world is full of people that want to condemn & judge any thing you say cause you are teaching TRUTH. I have the greatest respect for what you do and I love you for it.

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    1. Amein, sis. Thanks for taking the time to post!

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    2. Would Paul become a warlock to warlocks? I think there are limits.

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    3. I wasn't saying this of course not. Like Liam says "Whenever I talk to anyone, I always assess 'where they are' when it comes to 'God and the Bible' and try to use terms they are familiar with"

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  3. The operative phrase "Whenever I talk to anyone, I always assess 'where they are' when it comes to 'God and the Bible' and try to use terms they are familiar with" is a most important one. The Pharisees were the "Torah terrorists/pagan police" in the Messiah's day. What did some of them say to the Apostles about the Gentiles coming to know YHWH? "It is necessary for you to circumcise them and you should command them to guard the Torah of Moshe." (Acts 15:5). Telling the Gentiles that they "must do this" or "must do that" is the problem.

    What did James stand up and say? "(I) say that you should not be oppressors to them from the Gentiles who are turning to Elohim." (Acts 15:19). So the Apostles and elders agreed to "start slowly" with the Gentiles, send them a letter regarding four essential things they needed to begin so they could learn. Then the Gentiles could continue learning Torah in the assemblies. James even said this in so many words: "For from ancient generations in all cities Moshe had preachers in the synagogues that on every Shabbat they read him." (Acts 15:21). Did the letter to the Gentiles mean that the four things were the ONLY thing Gentiles had to observe! Certainly not! Learning YHWH's Name and His ways would come soon enough.

    Slowly, Gentiles and Jews alike can learn together that Torah is good for us, not something to be "demanded" and observed only because some "authority" said you HAD to do certain things in certain ways. When someone comes to understand that YHWH expects His people to be "set apart", holy, then Torah takes on a new dimension. See http://blog.therefinersfire.org/2015/09/torah-is-our-way-to-holiness.html

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  4. Oh dear me; sticks and stones being thrown at you, again? Shali- "I have spoken these things to you that in me there may be to you peace. In the world will be affliction to you, but take courage, I have conquered the world." (Yochanan 16:33)
    Shali- Hazak,hazak,v'nit'chazek! Armour up with your refined weapons not made with human hands; may YHWH arise and scatter your enemies; may every arrow, word curse, character assassination attempt return upon haSatan and his coharts. YHWH is FOR you, therefore, Adonai Tzv'oat is Commander who is a jealous jealous Elohim and will war against tyrannical ideologies.
    We cut off the giants head and we eat giants as our bread.

    ...."This woman – like many who find their way to Torah – was so arrogant and so full of herself, NO amount of explanation would have sufficed. I'm sure she will argue with Y'shua some day when she sees him!" I can hear the court hearing now; "Arrogant women: Y'shua, you know, I met this women (Shali) who corrected me shrewdly, correcting me on the use God's name. I was appalled; I told her we are not supposed to use God ever. Well, I got the last word in. Lord I did all this for you and in your; are you proud of me? Lord, are you there?
    Y'shua haMashiyach: Arrogant women, many cases like this have come before me with the same flagrant argument; Arrogant women: ...but Lord, Lord... I, I was only..."
    Y'shua haMashiyach: ".... I will profess...from everlasting, I have not known you. Depart from me, you workers of iniquity!"


    I STAND WITH YOU!

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    1. Kof - you are such an AWESOME friend! Thank you for the encouraging words. I cannot begin to explain how much I appreciate them!

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  5. A friend and I were just talking about this Yesterday and he used the funniest and most accurate analogy: Coming to Torah is like going through the stages of grief. Stage 1 - shock, stage 2 - anger, stage 3 - arrogance, stage 4 - humility - stage 5 - accepting their identity and charge as a citizen of the kingdom. Unfortunately, most get stuck in stage 3 LOL :D

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    1. WOW! Rekuzi - that's an AWESOME analogy - and SO TRUE! Thanks for posting!

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    2. I just read this reply and boy that is so right on!. But it is a shame that they get stuck on stage 3.

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  6. I confess that I was once one of those "Torah Terrorists" and "Pagan Polices". When I myself left the "land of Christianity", I was immature, full of myself, full of pride in what I had learned, and I wanted everyone to know everything I had learned immediately. I wanted to shout out to all my Christian friends that they were wrong, going to hell unless they right away stopped calling on "Jesus" and "God" and everything else opposite to what I had just learned.

    And not so surprisingly, most of them felt insulted and offended and thought that I was a nutcase. I drove everyone away and none of them were interested in the things that I had learned.

    And it was ME who ended up falling away from Faith, very badly. I ended up in a very miserable state for some years, humiliated and afflicted by many evils that came to me in my opinion because of my great pride, haughtiness and immaturity.

    Now I hold dear this Bible verse from Psalm 119:71:

    "It is for my good that I have been humbled;
    it was so that I would learn your laws."

    In His unspeakable mercy, YHWH brought me back after I was wandering lost and aimless far away from Him, for some years. I learned humility. I am still on that path. I still learn daily, I still get sharp reminders when I wander away from being humble, meek and loving. And it is good for me, as it teaches me how to walk this Way. I have a tendency to perfectionism and the desire to "be right". But I pray for this blessed humility from YHWH that will keep me lowly and meek, my heart wide open to love, and my lips speaking the Truth in the way our Father intends.

    Thank you for this beautiful reminder to all of us believers.
    Shalom.



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    1. Dear Anonymous - What a wonderful and heartfelt message! THANK YOU! It sounds as if you truly learned a lesson after YHWH put you out in "the wilderness" for awhile. Sometimes we must "hit bottom" before our eyes can be opened to our own sin. This is exactly what happened to happened to King Nebuchadnezzar (see Daniel 4). I always try to remember that all my teachings are never "about me" but rather, all about YHWH/Y'shua/Torah....

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  7. I too was saved under the name Jesus. For centuries before the letter 'J' came about and afterwards people didn't know His Qodesh name but they still prayed and had their prayers answered and miracles occurred. Amein.People prayed to a name in Greek, Latin or something else because that is all they knew. Their prayers were heard and answered and miracles occurred. THESE PEOPLE NEED TO THINK ABOUT THAT AND MAYBE THEY WILL REALIZE THAT TRUTH. Finally only His Ruach Ha'Kodesh can convict people on what name to use. All we can do is share and NEVER try and force what we may have accepted on another. Certainly we are to never quench the ruah of another with our tongue. Shalom achoti. YHWH's berakah!

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    1. Amein, Billy Dee! Thanks for taking the time to post here!

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    1. Thank you! And thanks for taking the time to post!

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  9. This is a good article you've written! Good to print and stick on the fridge! . It's easy to start verbally bashing the 'resistors' over the head because it's frustrating sometimes. You wonder why they can't see what's so blatantly obvious to us but some of us resisted, at first, too. It's easy to forget that. GOD bless you, Shali!

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    1. Thank you, Sue! You are sooo right! God bless you, too. Thanks for taking the time to post.

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  10. Thanks sis for yet again another good word! Unfortunately, too many of us have gotten stuck in that "stage 3" phase of turning to Torah. I think it is just another tactic of the enemy using our pride to stumble us, as we think now we know it all and are compelled to cram our new found knowledge down everyone's throat.
    "Speaking the truth in love" involves having an ear to hear and an eye to see where people are before we start sharing. Otherwise, we are just operating from a position of thinking we are superior to them.

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    1. Thank you for your kind and "right on" comment!

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  11. A Torah Terrorist uses his own walk and understanding as the yardstick by which he judges all others. That elevates the T.T. to a position he is not in the least but worthy of.

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    1. Excellent analogy, "Unknown" ... Thank you for your comment!

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  12. I was attacked for having a birthday party for my dog. We had a cake to celebrate it. I got attacked with it being of Nimrod and Tammuz. SMH What would you say to these people?

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    1. I would thank them for their comments and then "unfriend" them, LOL! There's no arguing with crazy people.

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  13. Another thing I would like to say, loved the comments made here. What I have learned is no one human can judge my faith, beliefs, and what I choose to call my God, I will have to answer to Yeshua, Jesus, for what I have none in this life. Did I walk humbly before Him, did I love & show mercy to the people in my life. I was saved in Jesus name and God so what? It didn't mean I was using a pagan name, because He knew what I was saying to Him. Now I know His name & I use it when I speak in prayer to Him. With Christians that don't know this I don't beat them over the head jus because they don't use YHWH or Yeshua. I pray that I can be an example of His love and for the chance to share with them why I use Yeshua & YHWH. WWJD that was a really good thing to think on. Shali it is because of you that I have more love & compassion on people, thanks for you friendship. I love you!

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    1. Exactly, Fallingwaters Barone! Thank you for your sweet comments!

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