tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post2031288283646460379..comments2024-03-28T09:40:11.664-07:00Comments on The Refiner's Fire Blog: Does the Bible Require a Flat Earth?Carmenhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14998146626031186940noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-87948029808081554502021-06-17T00:11:19.388-07:002021-06-17T00:11:19.388-07:00Oh forgot to mention something else.
5) The bib...Oh forgot to mention something else. <br /><br />5) The bible proves that there is a creator, and that is all that matters. How it was done does not matter. We can see the overwhelming evidence of the earth whether one sees it as a flat or one sees it as a sphere. Neither side can be proven with 100% factual evidence.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-86257588400721950112021-06-17T00:09:36.610-07:002021-06-17T00:09:36.610-07:00I just want to point out that either side cannot p...I just want to point out that either side cannot prove the shape of the earth. Regardless of the amount of evidence, both sides will try to counter-attack and try to debunk either side. Both sides are theories, and both sides even in scriptural cannot neither prove that the earth is flat or a sphere. <br /><br />However it is very irrelevant because whether one side or the other is right, in the very end we know the outcome of what will happen to the earth and that will mean that the earth will be consumed by fire and destroyed. Recreated and made a-new and thus it makes no difference to the shape, science behind the evidences. A theory stays a theory until it can be verified, proven, repeated and math must also support the theory in order for a theory to no longer become a theory.<br /><br />1) It does not affect salvation<br />2) Whether you decide to believe the shape being flat or sphere is irrelevant, it'll get destroyed and recreated in the future.<br />3) What is most important is working out salvation with fear and trembling. Renewing our minds and staying diligent in the faith of Yeshua and being obedient on a daily manner.<br />4) It's okay for either side to have a conversation, it just should not cause division among brethren as I have seen it happen. If one cannot respect each other's opinion (that means they are not facts), then the discussion is better left alone.<br /><br />Just my thoughts.<br />BlessingsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-28217411680395284002016-12-03T16:40:41.172-08:002016-12-03T16:40:41.172-08:00LOVE IT! TY :DLOVE IT! TY :DCSRayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06882812250947418678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-66916756525903598632016-11-30T12:51:06.953-08:002016-11-30T12:51:06.953-08:00[Conclusion]
You said: "I can either believe...[Conclusion]<br /><br />You said: "I can either believe theories, or the written Word of יהוה."<br /><br />Reply: If only it were that simple! Do you know the original, ancient language or have you drawn all your conclusions from English versions of YHWH's Word? But one more time: There is nothing wrong with scientific theories of the physical world. Absolutely none of those theories can ever contradict the Word! What we see of the physical world simply MUST jive with the Word! Some can make mistakes in their interpretation of what science says, or in what scripture says, but that does not make one right and the other wrong.<br /><br />You said: "I know the sun moves, water doesn't curve and their ratio (8 inches per mile) regarding the curvature of the earth has been shown to be wrong MANY times."<br /><br />Reply: Believe what you will, but you are very, very, sadly wrong. But I can see that any attempt at explaining anything to you would most likely be pointless. The sun does move, but in the solar system, (disregarding the motion of the sun in the galaxy), the earth is moving around the sun. This is simply fact (and does not defy scripture)! Regarding your dismissal of spherical earth because of the "problem" of not being able to "perceive" the curvature, well, it only means you are not willing to study the issue to understand why curvature is so difficult to detect and "see". If you were to dismiss all the quackery you find on the Internet about "200 Proofs the Earth is Flat" instead of dismissing actual facts, you'd be surprised at what you could learn.<br /><br />You said: "I think we have to be careful of claiming we know things as facts without proof, when we actually don't know a thing! Even the scientists admit that."<br /><br />Reply: Fact: The sun will rise tomorrow. I can't prove it to you. Therefore I guess you don't believe the sun will rise tomorrow. Corollary to your statement: "I think we need to be careful what we accept as "truth" (or "fact") and what we deny when that assessment is based on our own bias' and limitations." It's been a pleasure discussing this with you! Liamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00281049645175102119noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-36733550852838334312016-11-30T12:50:47.770-08:002016-11-30T12:50:47.770-08:00Well, "Grateful" dropped out of the disc...Well, "Grateful" dropped out of the discussion! Too bad. But since "Grateful" is anonymous, Here is my response to his/her deleted comment above:<br /><br />Thanks, "Grateful",<br /><br />I am compelled to respond. I agree with your first paragraph to great extent. TRUE seekers are digging into the WORD and are beginning to have the scales removed from their eyes. After that, you descended into speculation. Permit me to attempt a "course correction" though you are certainly free to believe what you want.<br /><br />You said: "Do you know that this discussion regarding the Heliocentric and Geocentric model has been debated for hundreds of years?"<br /><br />Reply: Absolutely yes, I knew that! But it a has been less of a "debate" that it has been an "argument". Before roughly the 3rd Century BCE, pretty much everyone assumed the model of the earth-sun system was geocentric. That is what it looks like. But from that time, more and more people began to see the clues that revealed the fact that the correct model of the earth-sun system is heliocentric. It is no longer a debate or an argument. It is fact. Again, my point of the article is that according to scripture, heliocentric or geocentric does not matter! Scripture is perfectly sound within the heliocentric model of the sun-earth system we know is a physical reality. My big "beef", if you will, with "flat earthers" is that it is only because they THINK scripture declares the earth is flat and the sun goes around the earth, they refuse to see the real world around them.<br /><br />You said: "Today, many scientists admit that their heliocentric model doesn't fit. They need to keep on adding "dark matter" to the universe to make their equations fit. Something is not right." <br /><br />Reply: You are somewhat correct, but mixing apples and oranges. You are confusing, I think, cosmology with the more local "solar system physics". Within our solar system, the heliocentric model is quite correct and accurate! There are very small perturbations but the equations, to several orders of magnitude, are quite accurate in describing the motion of the earth, moon, sun, and all the planets. Observed errors are due to many factors of which I'm not going to go into detail. But in the "grander scale" of the universe, things get even more complicated. "Dark matter" was proposed to explain the THEORY of the expansion of the universe. Yes, that theory is not perfect, has problems and scientists are doing, as they do, looking at the theory to find the problems. In my estimation, the difficulty scientist are having "explaining" the universe is not unexpected. After all, they are attempting to describe something created by a far superior entity! (Please realize, science only "describes". They can describe, mathematically all they want and it works fine as a predictive model, but it does not and will never replace YHWH any more than you can "describe" an apple. YHWH created it, you didn't.<br /><br />You said: "[Scientists] are willing to admit they are wrong! [Scientists] are willing to admit that they need to start looking at the Geocentric model since their theories..... Yes, THEORIES [don't] add up"<br /><br />Reply: Of course scientists are willing to admit they are wrong! All good scientists test a theory and if the theory fails, they try anew! But no, they do not need to look at the geocentric model "since their theories don't add up"! Again, you are mixing apples and oranges.<br /><br />[Concluded, next post]Liamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00281049645175102119noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-15325449723282983312016-11-29T21:29:04.446-08:002016-11-29T21:29:04.446-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gratefulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00637852983008828891noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-73434616576043804022016-11-29T19:53:41.442-08:002016-11-29T19:53:41.442-08:00Not sure I follow you, "Grateful". When...Not sure I follow you, "Grateful". When I ended my article with "It didn't matter then and it doesn't matter now" I was talking about the flat vs. round earth argument. I'm not changing scripture or adding to scripture. <br /><br />Fact is, the earth is a rotating sphere, in orbit around the sun. We know that. We can still accept and believe scripture knowing that truth which was unknown in ancient times. My argument in no way agrees with or condones anti-Torah teachings of, as you said: "Homosexuality / Torah / Shabbat / Tzitzit / Creation / what we eat 'doesn't matter'"! All those matter, of course! But many have misread the scriptures only to conclude that the earth must be flat. And since they accept that scripture is "inerrant", they feel they must accept that the true nature of the earth must be false. All I was trying to say is that the true nature of the earth (round, rotating, in orbit around the sun) is perfectly in accordance with scripture! Scripture IS inerrant! It's our translations and interpretations which are erred! <br /> Liamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00281049645175102119noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-74076973447758241352016-11-29T10:01:24.914-08:002016-11-29T10:01:24.914-08:00Thanks, Fallingwaters Barone!Thanks, Fallingwaters Barone!Carmenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14998146626031186940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-25900723074202320182016-11-29T09:24:01.887-08:002016-11-29T09:24:01.887-08:00Amen Brother. Time someone said it.Amen Brother. Time someone said it.Fallingwatershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08325996378970601462noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5193745359560427451.post-77580174750002700732016-11-29T03:12:30.546-08:002016-11-29T03:12:30.546-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gratefulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00637852983008828891noreply@blogger.com